Is Batman The Killing Joke Connected To Animated Series

Spoiler alarm!

This recap is intended for folks who've already seen the movie, and will include a clarification of its events!

The latest Batman film, The Killing Joke, has been anticipated for a long time past some comic book fans, while dreaded by others. Controversy about its themes and influence has surrounded the 1988 graphic novel in recent years. Its adaptation, now available for purchase subsequently a brief theatrical run, has likely pushed both sides of the debate further into their respective arguments. The flick doesn't attempt to fix critics' problems; instead, it may have produced more than of them.

The Killing Joke is based on a classic Alan Moore story near "one bad day" for the Night Knight and his curvation-nemesis, The Joker. Some fans and writers take taken result with its representation of Barbara Gordon, the original Batgirl and the girl of Gotham Police Commissioner Jim Gordon. Barbara serves as little more a plot device inside The Killing Joke, some suggest; a once-beloved, retired grapheme is brought back just to be quickly done away with.

But The Killing Joke's cinematic adaptation gives Barbara expanded screen time — as well as a romantic infatuation with Batman, her mentor. That'south a big modify from the original work, one that non anybody was happy with when the moment made the rounds after the film's San Diego Comic-Con premiere.

To understand the complexities that surround The Killing Joke as both cinematic and cultural text, I recruited two other members of Polygon to talk over the motion-picture show and its source textile with me, each one coming to it from a unlike perspective. Our social media manager, Ashley Oh, has played through all of the Batman: Arkham games, while our entertainment editor, Susana Polo, is a lifelong fan with an encyclopedic knowledge of all things Batman. (I watched Batman: The Animated Series and other cartoons as a kid and am into the Christopher Nolan trilogy.)

Read on for our chat.

The trouble with translating a controversial comic to the screen

Allegra: I watched The Killing Joke concluding night, and although I only just read the story it's based on before this week, my reading experience heavily colored my interpretation of the film.

What I like about The Killing Joke as a graphic novel is how well it uses the medium in telling the story. The story is primarily about The Joker, the most iconic of Batman's villains, as he plans to drive Batman and his friend Commissioner Gordon to the edge. Flashbacks to his tragic backstory every bit a failed comedian are contrasted with his horrific present-solar day absurdity, with each timeline defined by some excellent artwork past Brian Bolland. The Joker's eyes pop out, his grin is frightening, and even on the static comic volume folio, his wiry frame and bold coloring highlight what a disturbed, dynamic character he is.

On an aesthetic level, I thought the film failed to capture the expressiveness of the comic'southward style, to its detriment. Animation has more artistic tools than comics at its disposal, only the film looked similar a longer episode of a not-particularly-impressive drawing. For me, that made tTe Joker's duality fall flat — which is a big problem, because that is the story's most compelling facet.

I'm curious equally to your take, Ashley, as someone in a like position: not a huge reader of the Bat-comics, but familiar with the original story. Did you take result with the blitheness? What parts of The Killing Joke as a graphic novel did you lot see or not see replicated on screen?

Ashley: The manner of animation didn't offend me as much as information technology did other people. I thought it harkened back to some of the older animated shows, simply I'm not sure if that was the intention. I do know that there'due south the remastered coloring of The Killing Joke graphic novel and the original one, which has a starkly different experience. I was expecting something with a little more grit along those lines in the blithe moving picture, but who knows if that was an artistic liberty or a matter of budget.

The same insidiously dark Joker whom I know from the Batman: Arkham games, and not Batman: The Animated Series (despite the same actor working on both franchises), is who I heard in The Killing Joke. Mark Hamill's definitely evolved in his role equally The Joker, specially afterwards the games. And I think I wanted that to interpret into not merely the motion picture's animation way, simply possibly even the coloring as well. Sure, he'due south still funny, he'southward off his rocker, but he inspires an underlying fear that you're a hair trigger away from beingness violently bludgeoned to death.

In terms of parts that came across well on screen, I enjoyed the reflections of his by. It's kind of hard to mess that up, and that dialogue with his wife offered these tiny crumbs of sympathy that I really didn't heed taking. I did, still, take outcome with the attempt at laying down a foundation of sorts for Barbara in the beginning. Trying to get an audience to care about a character who's used generally as a plot device (in this installment) is difficult, and I empathize that, merely information technology seemed to me like it leaned hard on a cliched quick gear up.

The original The Killing Joke (left) and the recolored version (right)

Susana, I'm curious about your thoughts on how Barbara was framed in this motion picture. In the graphic novel, there's absolutely no indication that there'south annihilation sexual between her and Batman. Given that The Killing Joke had a 2-mean solar day release window in theaters, and that perhaps a majority of the audience may already be die-difficult fans familiar with the original version, why do you think they had to feature that?

"All I could call back was, 'This is going to be a fucking disaster.'"

Susana: Honestly, I retrieve it's the thing near the adaptation that I dislike the most. Alan Moore is one of the greats of comics, but even he has spoken openly about how he doesn't retrieve the book is his all-time piece of work and that he never intended information technology to exist a part of the DC Universe's ongoing canon. I hateful, 20 years later he literally referred to his treatment of Barbara Gordon in The Killing Joke equally "shallow and sick-conceived."

The news that Warner Bros. Blitheness would be adapting The Killing Joke was greeted with trepidation from many of the comic book people I know. It'south a volume that's very much rooted in the comic book cultural context of its fourth dimension, and — to put it mildly — it hasn't aged well.

When The Killing Joke was published, the mainstream idea of Batman was still the 1960s Adam West and Burt Ward prove, and superhero comics were pushing dorsum difficult against the mainstream impression of camp heroes created past comics' own version of the Hays Lawmaking. Barbara Gordon as Batgirl was a character who'd been adjusted into comics from that television show.

In 2006, Alan Moore told Magician Magazine, "I asked DC if they had any problem with me crippling Barbara Gordon — who was Batgirl at the time — and if I recall, I spoke to Len Wein, who was our editor on the project ... [He] said, 'Yeah, okay, cripple the bitch.'" 1988's Batgirl Special #1 had the grapheme retire her cape and tights before The Killing Joke came out and further removed the character from the DC writers' playing board by permanently injuring her.

In the three decades since The Killing Joke was published, there'southward been an ongoing discussion in the comics community about the concept of "fridging" — a term coined by comics author Gail Simone that comes from a plotline in another DC comic — for when a story injures, kills or sexually assaults a female person grapheme in order to motivate a male hero, thus reducing her character to a plot device. The Killing Joke, in which the Joker shoots Barbara Gordon in the spine, strips her naked, takes photos of her, and (depending on your estimation) rapes her, is perchance the most infamous employ of that platitude that is still a articulate and present office of DC comics canon.

Since DC's line-wide reboot in 2011, which made Barbara an able-bodied superhero again but kept the events of the Killing Joke canon, a lot of folks in the comics community take been asking why nosotros're so attached to this particular part of the book. The small part of the story devoted to The Joker'due south attack on Barbara is the only role of The Killing Joke that stubbornly remains true in the DC Universe, while the plotline that forms the majority of the thematic heft of the volume — Moore's Joker origin story (the one that you felt was the more constructive part of the moving picture, Ashley) — does not.

Barbara and Batman's romantic relationship boggles the mind

When the folks behind the adaptation announced that they'd be enlarging Barbara'southward function for their moving-picture show, it was the least they could do if they were going to be bringing back such a controversial, criticized and dated story, in my opinion. But it boggles the mind that they thought the mode to positively aggrandize on the minimal function of a female grapheme was to put her in a sexual relationship with the male hero — who, let'due south be clear, is a decade older than her and in a position of ability over her every bit her mentor and is the surrogate father of her close friend and on-once more, off-again young man, Dick Grayson, and is one of her father'southward best friends — and and then change nil else most the story. The thought that they idea the best way to requite Barbara a bigger role was to have her fuck Batman, thus turning the story of him hunting down The Joker to avenge a former sidekick and the girl of his all-time friend into i about paying the Joker back for sexually violating a adult female he'due south sexually claimed ... but I digress.

I institute out about this modify through the comics-folk grapevine prior to the motion picture's premiere, and all I could call up was, "This is going to be a fucking disaster." This isn't the first time a Bruce Timm-written story has paired Bruce and Barbara — information technology was as well established to take happened in the DC Animated Universe, one-time between the "present-day" events of Batman: The Animated Serial and the "future" timeline of Batman Beyond — and all of the die-hard fans of Across that I know (myself included) would really like to but forget that particular role of that item episode e'er happened.

So I guess what I'm trying to say, Ashley, is that I don't know why they made the terrible decision to have her and Batman blindside, except that maybe Bruce Timm ships it. What's actually fascinating to me is that I read The Killing Joke virtually xv years ago, and have been hoovering upwards obscure comics history tidbits for even longer. I tin can't imagine how The Killing Joke goes over in the year 2016 without whatever of that context.

The Killing Joke film makes a big change, but non for the better

Allegra: I can't, either, Susana — fifty-fifty though the "prequel" episode that opens the motion-picture show is entirely original, it seems unfathomable to me that anyone would understand or capeesh it without having some familiarity with the history backside The Killing Joke and Barbara Gordon. Only at that place are major issues with the presentation of this Batgirl-focused opening, even without the noesis that leads u.s.a. to believe it's a canonical failure.

Batgirl's brusque story is well-nigh the relationships betwixt men and women. Throughout the half-hour episode, she's chasing after a group of sexist men who make comments about her looks, flirt with her at every plough and, past the end, proclaim to beloved her.

Her response is to be flattered by the bad guys' gross obsession. Batgirl is a young college student, and then it makes sense that she has sex on the brain. But she's also shown to be a capable fighter and an intelligent hacker. These are treated as asides, even so, in favor of emphasizing her guy troubles. That's disappointing, because Batgirl has clear potential to be a strong female person hero, simply the writers insist on sexualizing her equally her best features become small details.

Batman is no "yoga teacher"

A lot of this is made explicit, as well; everything is so ham-fisted, with Barbara complaining to her young male friend about a "yoga teacher" who won't pay attending to her. We know exactly who she's talking nigh. Just as our friend and Polygon opinion editor Ben Kuchera said to me when we discussed the film earlier, Batman is no "yoga teacher."

Reducing their relationship into a student-teacher infatuation isn't unwarranted, even if it'south a little gross. Only there's nothing within the film that motivates it, considering Batman remains as stoic as always. Their interactions become heated due to Barbara's emotional outbursts as her crush grows deeper. For the writers, this escalation for a young, bonny woman just naturally has to terminate with sex.

It all feels odd and is an unfortunate mode to narrate someone who could, and should, be a fascinating immature woman. What's worse is that the foul sense of taste of the opening threatens the narrative of The Killing Joke, which otherwise has picayune to do with Barbara and keeps her around only as a powerless victim for the story's sake. What did you make of Barbara's office in the main role of the movie, Ashley? Did the prequel affect how you felt well-nigh what came after?

Ashley: The prequel set a mild expectation that something like their hookup was going to happen. More than anything, it seemed similar the writers wanted to hammer in the fact that she has something to show. Even though the flattery she received from those guys was gross and insincere, it was nonetheless recognition. She reveled in it. And that'due south something she wasn't getting from Batman.

At that place's inappreciably a scene where Barbara isn't talking almost men or questing after one, bad guy or not. Information technology seemed like a false hope that we'd take a strong female hero who could pass the Bechdel exam. In 1 fell dive of a curt "later," Batman turns Batgirl into nothing simply an anxious daughter pining for his approval with a desperate phone call. The best part about that was probably the cacophony of incredulous groans and laughter in the theater when information technology happened.

Barbara's determination to turn in her gear also seemed to be fueled by the introduction of that bad-mannered situation — it would've been far more impactful had it just been about hesitation and fearfulness toward the "abyss" that she and Batman spoke of earlier. In fact, I think that the prequel would've fit in with the film far better with this notion. We come across that scene where Batgirl essentially loses control and nearly kills a guy in a blind rage. Instead, that acrimony gets translated into a sexual impulse with her mentor. Does the only female character in this movie really need to be put in that context?

I totally concord you with, Allegra, about how this changes the angle of The Killing Joke. Information technology colors how Batman goes afterwards The Joker in a way that felt less ... intimate than the graphic novel. Mayhap one of the nearly iconic lines in the volume is, "I've been thinking lately. Virtually you and me. Nearly what'due south going to happen to us, in the end. We're going to kill each other, aren't we?" That's the crux right there.

The crux of The Killing Joke is watered down on-screen

And even so somehow it gets watered down here; the very notion of Barbara is spliced in there when Batman speaks to The Joker. Batman doesn't demand another reason to go after the Joker or to hate him more than he already does. So why add that in? The film wasn't in theaters for more than a couple of days, and it's not similar they were aiming for a summertime blockbuster to entreatment to mass audiences with a little drama. I'm still baffled.

Susana: Everything almost information technology is baffling, and I haven't fifty-fifty seen the movie. Nor do I program to — I'm just the resident comics skilful for this post. And it's my expert opinion that before we wrap up, we should talk a little bit about the film's concluding effort to nod at the idea that Barbara Gordon might really exist a grapheme and not just an angst switch for the men in her life: the end-credits sequence that teases her return as Oracle.

Outraged by the style that DC editorial and The Killing Joke could so cavalierly care for Barbara Gordon, comics editor and writer Kim Yale — forth with her married man, writer John Ostrander — introduced a character chosen Oracle into Suicide Team in 1989, a year after The Killing Joke came out. In 1990 they revealed that Oracle, a hacker anonymously offer to aid the government-sponsored group of supervillains, was Barbara Gordon. That same twelvemonth, Oracle beginning appeared in a Batman comic as the Caped Crusader'southward confidante and a powerful data resource. She appeared briefly once more, in 1993, before Yale and Ostrander finally got to write a six-effect origin story for her, Oracle: Twelvemonth One, in 1996.

Information technology took viii years, but the 2 managed to bring the grapheme back from the editorial no-get zone, telling a story about Barbara Gordon overcoming depression and physical trauma to reapply her experience with technology, her photographic memory and her genius intellect in a way that was invaluable and irreplaceable to her allies. In the same yr, writer Chuck Dixon proved that Barbara Gordon could still be a compelling lead character past putting her in charge of the Birds of Casualty, her own all-female undercover ops team, in a comic that has run well-nigh continuously in various forms and re-numberings for 20 years. Past the stop of the '00s, Oracle didn't just have Gotham'south vigilantes coming to her for assist, but the Justice League itself. She was one of the only prominent disabled superheroes in the entirety of American comics.

Barbara'south transformation into the character of Oracle is brought up ofttimes every bit show in back up of The Killing Joke remaining canon. And it's technically truthful that if The Killing Joke hadn't been written, she probably wouldn't always have transitioned from an agile function every bit Batgirl to the more than passive merely more than powerful role of the DC Universe's most reliable information banker, hacker and tactical leader.

Information technology took years to find Barbara Gordon a new place in the universe

But it took 8 years to notice Barbara Gordon — at the time the only female character in the Bat-family — a new place in the DC Universe. And it is unequivocally true that the hard work information technology took to get there wasn't done considering of The Killing Joke, but rather in spite of it. There wouldn't even exist some other Batgirl in DC comics canon until 1999.

And, of course, in 2011, DC's New 52 reboot erased (or, at all-time, from very recent developments, severely minimized) Oracle from the catechism. In mandating that Barbara be Batgirl once again, the visitor removed the character's ability to fully represent disability, but besides, paradoxically, kept Barbara's attack in The Killing Joke. All the lemonade that after comic writers had made out of Killing Joke lemons for more than twenty years was erased.

Ironically, it sounds like the Killing Joke movie did the opposite — it took some lemons, and just added more, bigger lemons. No wonder it's leaving a sour taste in so many mouths.

Allegra: I call up that's exactly right, Susana — the film doesn't seek to correct any of the problems critics had with The Killing Joke. Instead, information technology just adds to them. An interview on Vulture with the artistic squad suggests that the writers lacked of awareness of how people read betwixt the lines with the comic book, and so information technology makes sense that there's no endeavour at form correction here.

That's disappointing equally someone who appreciates what Bruce Timm did for the Batman universe with The Blithe Series and has a lot of respect for his work in animation. Only more than than that, it'south disappointing every bit someone who consumes culture in 2016, and does and so with the promise that creators consider all of the implications and effects of their content before sending information technology out to a mass audience.

I like The Killing Joke as a story and a piece of fine art. I did not actually like The Killing Joke as a film. I'g not so beholden to the work for that to be a major thwarting for me, and I know that many Batman fans weren't disappointed with it at all. I just see it as a missed opportunity — both in giving Batgirl her due diligence, also every bit translating a beautiful graphic novel to the big screen, where it could take been so expressive and thousand and spectacular. Instead, information technology feels similar ... a direct-to-DVD release. Which, like, there are worse things. But there are amend things, too.